0 to 1,000,000 Streams in 90 Days: Evan Jacobson’s Viral Blueprint for Musicians
Viral sax covers turned bedroom practice into arena‑packing musical movement
Here's a conversation with Evan Jacobson, my podcast guest this week on That One Time with Adam Metwally.
A New York‑based saxophonist famous for adding solos to songs that don’t need them, Evan’s Coldplay Sparks cover went mega‑viral, built 695 k TikTok followers, 190 k on Instagram, and landed his band Stolen Gin on festival stages like Gov Ball.
Below are some of the key concepts we explored in the episode:
– The repeatable three‑step test Evan uses to pick covers that cross 1 million views.
The lean posting rhythm that took him from 0 to 695 000 followers while keeping creative sanity.
The email‑list‑plus‑live‑show funnel converting 10 % of online fans into ticket buyers in every city.
Timestamps:
00:00 The viral saxophone journey
02:53 Authenticity in music and content creation
06:14 Balancing content and artistic integrity
09:00 From digital reach to live show fans
12:14 Building a strong live performance
14:50 Marketing strategies for original music
17:51 The future of music marketing
21:00 Converting viral moments into lasting connections
24:05 Overcoming imposter syndrome
26:53 Consistency over perfection
27:39 Building a brand identity
32:56 Navigating low‑engagement slumps
36:58 Honesty over people‑pleasing
39:04 Acts of kindness and relationships
43:21 Creating meaningful art
48:59 Upcoming projects and lessons learnt
It’s up on YouTube, Spotify, X and everywhere else.
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Here’s the full transcript:
Speaker 1 (00:00.214)
Evan, welcome to the podcast. Thank you for coming. Yeah, I’m very much looking forward to this.
What’s up, Adam? Thanks for having me. It’s been a long time coming.
Speaker 1 (00:13.41)
My first question for you is, your saxophone covers like Coldplay’s Sparks.
Speaker 1 (00:27.054)
went massively viral, earning you the title of the saxophonist who broke the internet. So what do you think is the secret to the success of the series adding sax solos to songs that don’t need them and specifically why this song connected?
Just going back to the beginning of the series, was always, I mean, that’s always the way that I practiced saxophone. I, you know, I come from this jazz background, but I always was interested in how can I take what I’m learning here and apply it to songs that people are listening to nowadays? Not that people don’t listen to jazz nowadays, but you know what I mean. And this was just always something that I did is, know, trying to play something on my saxophone that fit over a Coldplay song or a Tame Impala song. Tame Impala is the one that I started the series on like back in 2020. which is...
So long ago. The secret to me has always been how can I add to this in a way that is authentic to me and what I’m naturally hearing, not think too hard about it. But I also don’t want to take away from the original. So I want to maintain that original spirit of, in this case, Sparks, which is this very pretty, beautiful, almost haunting song.
add something that like complements that and tries to expand on it, but not overshadow or kind of, I never want to do too much. I want to compliment. And the whole point of the series is we’re adding saxophone to songs that don’t need them. So this is a beautiful song on its own. I just want to kind of add that little bit of flavor, that little like jazz element that people are, that seems to resonate with people nowadays. So that’s always my goal is to kind of
add something that I’m naturally hearing and that I like but is not so virtuosic that it’s taking away from the song or people don’t recognize the song that I’m playing over top of.
Speaker 1 (02:17.004)
Yeah, great. So how did your authenticity shape that? And how can others work out how to be authentic in music and content creation?
You know, I think, I mean, I’ve made hundreds of these videos at this point and like Sparks was definitely the one that caught on the biggest in terms of just the amount of people that it reached. I think, you know, I never, you know, I try to always play something that sounds like, that sounds like me. I’m not trying to, you know, emulate another saxophone player when I do this. And, you know,
I’ve given myself literally hundreds of chances to go viral and to meet these people where they’re at. And that’s, you know, of course a big part of content creation and being a musician these days is you have to continuously be creating and putting out work. So I think, you know, the path to kind of finding your authentic voice is one of constantly putting out new things and trying new things and
just be willing to adapt and to change and to meet people where they’re at. mean, not every video is going to go viral. Not every song is going to connect with the audience that you want it to. But the more chances you give yourself to do that, the more likely it’s going to happen.
Yeah, you’ve mentioned in the past that you don’t necessarily like volume though. So how do you find that balance?
Speaker 2 (03:38.638)
I try to, it’s a delicate balance. think the pressures of, you know, being online today dictate that you need to be putting out content like five times a week, which, you know, for some people that’s probably a good strategy for me. And I think for a lot of other musicians, that just doesn’t work because we want to put out, you know, a piece of high quality. And honestly, that’s just not always realistic to do that five times a week, especially with, you know, various other things going on. I think
You know, you kind of have to just find a balance that works for you. I’ve kind of become okay with not being the creator that puts out a ton of new videos every week or a ton of videos every month. I go through periods where I’m filming, you know, three or four times a week. And then I go through periods where I’m not filming at all. So I’ve kind of just managed to be okay with that balance. And also, you know, when I’m not shooting content, when I’m not trying to make new videos or when I’m not trying to add
saxophone solos to songs that don’t need them. I am usually all focused on something else that I’m passionate about, whether that’s writing music with my band, Stolen Gin, or putting together a new jazz house demo for this new project that I’m working on, or trying to send over recording to a DJ. for me, it’s always been about not just being a content creator, but someone who has a diverse set of musical skills and avenues that I can pursue.
Do you think it takes away, the content creation takes away from the creation of the art? Because you feel, I feel like there’s a lot of pushback from lot of artists that are like, I shouldn’t need to do this.
I don’t think it does. think, you know, the actual act of content creation is just, to me, it’s just like sharing your music, which is something that artists have to do anyway, but it’s just in a different format. I think the actual act of like having to post all this time and, know, having to be so active on the platforms, I think that’s what the artists are turned off by, or at least that’s what I sort of get frustrated by. But the actual act of just like sharing your music online via these platforms, Instagram, Reels, TikTok, whatever.
Speaker 2 (05:45.326)
I think that’s just the way it’s evolved. whether you like it or not, we live in this digital age and this is the way that people are discovering music. And honestly, there’s a lot of music that goes viral, especially on TikTok. And I really love a lot of it. I don’t think that TikTok being the medium that people use to go viral these days necessarily diminishes the quality of the music.
Maybe just the time of the actual track because people have
Yeah, you think like how short it needs to be? Yeah, like, yeah, maybe.
turning into two minute songs instead of eight minute.
That could be, but like, I don’t know. mean, there’s ambient music that goes viral now. mean, you know, no one would have been listening to ambient music in, you know, 2016, like kids, especially, you know, now there’s like, you know, 19 year old ambient music producers that are finding success through TikTok. I don’t think personally that TikTok is lowering the overall quality of music that’s coming out. I think in some ways it’s actually inspiring people to be more creative and
Speaker 2 (06:55.886)
Maybe it’s working better for some genres than others, but I think honestly it’s opened up a lot of creative possibilities for people. I think you have more people focusing on thinking about their branding and their overall aesthetic as an artist. And that’s important stuff. think that living in the social media age, yeah, it’s made it more challenging and it’s made the content demands much higher, but I don’t think it’s necessarily bad for music.
Yeah. Well, you’ve done pretty well on the media side of the music. You know, you’ve got like 600,000 on your TikTok. You’ve got a couple hundred thousand on Instagram. That’s a pretty big reach. Have you found that it’s had a meaningfully positive impact on your outcomes as a career musician or is it just kind of noise and a bit of fun?
No, I mean, my goal has always been not to just be like a content creator. Obviously, it’s been a great avenue. It’s been a great thing for me to kind of explore and to get my music out there. But for me, it’s just like one tool in the toolbox in terms of sharing my music with people. My goal has always been to like, you know, put people onto my original music, which is something that I’ve started doing more recently. But yeah, I mean,
It’s fun and it’s great and it brings in a lot of cool opportunities, a lot of cool opportunities to like work with new producers and DJs and you know, I’ll get, you know, artists and producers hitting me up for sax solos and stuff like that, which I love. But, you know, ultimately my goal has always been, I want to be a musician first, content creator second. So I definitely don’t claim to be the best content creator out there. mean, my posting schedule, I think speaks for itself on that front. I don’t...
post as regularly as probably is recommended for any type of music content creator. you know, that’s all right. That’s just been my strategy. And, you know, my goal again has always been like, I want to put people onto, I want to direct people to my Spotify and to check out my original music that I’m putting out.
Speaker 1 (09:00.684)
Yeah. So what tools other than content creation do you use to share music to an audience and build new audiences?
That’s a good question. Honestly, mean, content creation is definitely the biggest one. But, you know, aside from that, it’s the live show. It’s like getting people to come out to like a club date or, you know, to a DJ event. That’s like, to me, that’s like the dessert. That’s like the reward is getting to play the live show and like getting to share this music with people in a live setting. Because oftentimes it’s like people will have just seen me through Instagram or TikTok and then they come to the live show. And that’s when it feels like
That’s when it feels like, right, I’ve made a new fan or a new friend. And that is always like the best thing for me is like, because you know, the TikTok and the digital side is a great introduction for people. It gets people in the door, but you know, with attention spans being what they are these days, actually like getting those people to stick around and be a fan and be engaged and, you know, pop out to a live show. Like that is what really makes it real. So TikTok is...
The digital thing is sort of the introduction. And when people come to the live show, that’s like, all right, now you’re part of the family.
Yeah. So I mean, I’ve worked as a booker in Australia for a while and I’ve fallen into the trap of booking artists who have massive streams and then can’t sell a couple of tickets. So how have you managed to take those potential views and turn them into actual fans? What are the strategies there?
Speaker 2 (10:33.006)
I think cultivating your online fan base and cultivating your in-person fan base are two different things. you know, I think a lot of people fall victim to, you know, they go viral on TikTok, but they haven’t really spent that much time honing their live show. And then when people show out to their live show and it’s, you know, either prerecorded or, you know, the live show is not that rehearsed or whatever, then I think people realize like, okay, this is not, you know.
This is the live show and the live experience clearly hasn’t been thought about as much.
a lot of people don’t even like get to that point. They don’t even go to the show. Yeah.
So, I mean, I can only speak from the side of like my touring band, which is Stolen Gen, which is me and four other guys.
Have you had any viral success with that band? Are you leading that?
Speaker 2 (11:20.684)
Little bit. No, I mean, you know, that’s always a group effort. We do a lot. It’s kind of the same strategy that I use on my page is like, let’s get people in the door with covers. And then once they’re here, then they’re going to discover this whole, you know, breadth of original music that that is, you know, what I think is of high quality. Yeah, I mean, when we go to this, you know, I’ve toured the most
and you’ve found it actually works.
Speaker 2 (11:44.718)
with that band rather than my stuff. I just want to make that clear. But when we go to the shows, you know, we ask people, hey, how’d you find out about Stolen Gin? And it’s usually a good mix of, I found you on TikTok or my friend went to the show and told me to come, or I went to a show, I randomly stumbled upon your thing. But to answer your first question, I think, you know, the important thing to do is, like, TikTok is, the digital thing is one side of the coin. I think honing the live act, being rehearsed.
being good at your instrument or at, you know, at just performing in person is hugely important. And I think something that’s probably a little bit undervalued in today’s musical landscape. Like if you, if you have a good live show these days, you’re automatically kind of set apart from people.
Yeah, I’m noticing that as well with the DJing side of things you really need to separate yourself because there’s so much.
DJing is hard too because it’s like, you know, to some degree you’re playing, like I think the bar is higher in some ways, like for a DJ to like stand out because, you know, everyone’s kind of lower barrier to entry and you know, to some degree everyone’s kind of playing tracks that they may or may not have had something to do with.
Yeah, right. So it’s like, how are you going to separate yourself? Is it your track selection? Is it the way that you jump around on stage? Is it the way that you mix stuff together? I think it’s harder to separate yourself as a DJ.
Speaker 1 (13:12.206)
of probably like, again, it comes down to content, like having an audience of people interested in you, having different elements, like we’re talking about doing this live thing, writing your own music and then playing your own custom edits and no one else has a copy of it. Like that’s kind of it, and then your energy. And track selection is really important. And there is a big difference between like a DJ who’s not that good and a DJ who’s good. And maybe you can’t tell.
actively, but you can’t, there’s something different and a lot of people do feel it.
think today it’s like, it’s really interesting because I mean, DJing is, it’s easy to get your foot in the door, but then, you know, after that, it’s like much harder to kind of break out and separate yourself. Yeah. I mean, I don’t envy the world of DJs. I’m lucky in that I kind of specialize in something that’s a little bit more niche. playing with DJs is like one of my favorite, absolute favorite things to do. Cause it’s fun. People love,
Yeah, definitely.
Speaker 2 (14:13.804)
Something about hearing like a live instrument over a DJ track, it gets people going. Yeah, people love it. And then like, of course, like sax house is like a huge thing. You know, I try not to go in the, when I’m playing with a DJ, I try not to go like the traditional like wailing sax over a corny house beat route. But yeah, I just try to infuse it with my own thing. But yeah, I mean,
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (14:40.728)
DJing is tough, know, it’s like one of those things where everyone thinks that they can do it and then you see like the people who are actually good at and you’re like, maybe not.
Yeah. Yeah. It’s it’s lucky it’s not my career. It’s just something fun I do on the side, right? Yeah. So what strategies, what are the strategy shifts between marketing edits versus marketing, original music, or if any?
I think these days you kind of have to, and maybe this goes back to what you were saying before, it’s like, are you cheapening your brand in order to get people in the door and to listen to your music? I think these days you do have to kind of meet people where they’re at and like...
How do you find that out?
I just have noticed that like, if you can, as an original musician, as someone who’s putting out original music, if you can say, if you can give people a hook to be like, this is something that you already know, and this is how I, as an artist, am adding to it. So for example, with me, it’s adding songs to, adding saxophone solos to songs that people already know and love. you know, for someone who’s, know, for an R &B singer, it might be, hey, I’m gonna take,
Speaker 2 (15:56.334)
love by Keisha Cole and add my own verse. So you’re giving people something that they already know and that they’re really familiar with, but then you’re adding your own spin on it. And you’re sort of creating your brand that way. Like creating a brand almost by association. Like this is what I do, but this is who I identify with. So like for someone who’s a fan of R &B, they’re going to say, oh, I love Keisha Cole. I love this song. Let’s see how this person is able to like put their own spin on it and make it their own. you know, I think the strategy overwhelmingly has become
get people in door with covers and edits and your versions of songs that people know and love. And then through that process, people will be introduced to your original music. And if you do that enough times, then eventually you’ll build up the trust between you and your audience that they will naturally just be gravitating towards the original music that you put out rather than having to say, here’s my version of a Coldplay song. Here’s my version of a Beyonce song, whatever. I don’t know if that makes sense. But I think in a day and age where so much content, both
short form video content and music content is being uploaded every single second, every single day. You need to give people something to latch onto, something that people know and recognize and love. Get them in the door that way. And then that’s when you can kind of slowly start that process of converting them over to be a fan of your original stuff.
What do you think’s next strategically on music marketing? So where are we going next, if you could guess?
I think that until there’s a new app. Yeah. I, know, it’s hard to say. I think short form like shook up the game so much. It’s really only been like six years since it like 2020 is of course, like when it really started popping off. Of course, you know, Tik Tok was kind of a dancing after the first like couple of
Speaker 1 (17:28.737)
or media form.
Speaker 1 (17:34.639)
It’s only been a few years.
Speaker 1 (17:39.97)
It really, really took off.
Speaker 1 (17:46.958)
Instagram didn’t even do reels until like 2021 or something.
You know, I have a hard time believing that something is going to like, I almost feel like short form media has like peaked in that way. Like I don’t see how it can get much better than it has. I almost wonder that. I mean, that’s kind of why I feel like the live show is so valuable moving forward, because it’s something that is becoming increasingly rare to find a good live show with people who are known for their digital presence. I think, you know,
The live music industry is very impactful and successful right now. I think one, because people couldn’t go to concerts in COVID and then there was this huge boom of concert attendance post COVID. two, just because I think people are so... There’s not that many amazing artists who can also perform an amazing live show. So I think really focusing on that is something that will set you apart. And I do think that like...
You know, building a fan base off of touring is definitely the slow and like arduous way of going about it, but it’s definitely not like a dead art form. Like you can definitely still grow a fan base that way.
Yeah, I mean, it’s just hard to scale and expensive, but.
Speaker 2 (19:08.494)
Of course, but for someone who doesn’t want to like make TikToks every day and like, you know, sink a bunch of money into like producing content, you know, it’s better than nothing.
Yeah, definitely. I did a podcast with a guy called Brendan Abernathy. It hasn’t come out yet, but it be out pretty soon, probably before this one. And his whole thing is he spent like years just touring the country, living in his car. And he was like, I mean, we’re slowly getting to here. And he doesn’t have a big social media following. But he was like, I could probably sell a hundred tickets across the country. And he’s still a relatively small artist, but that’s not bad. So he can tour.
probably 100 cities and do maybe 100 tickets in each city.
Yeah, I mean, it’s a totally different world. mean, and being able to sell a hundred tickets in every city, mean, that’s, you know, that’s really impressive. Honestly, you know, like you said, there’s people with millions of monthly listeners, hundreds of thousands of followers who can’t go to a random city in the U S and sell 50 tickets. I mean, yeah, it’s a crazy time that we live in where there’s never been such a disparity between like online attention versus, you know, getting people to actually come to the shows.
Yeah. Well, on that note, if you were to start again from zero today, what would you do? What would be your strategy?
Speaker 2 (20:30.178)
When I first kind of had my taste of like viral success with this series, I was so taken aback and overwhelmed by the amount of stuff that came in within like a week. And, you know, I was, it’s pretty scary when that first happens. It’s like, okay, what do I want to do? You know, I know this is a big moment, but how do I like capitalize on this? How do I turn this into something that’s, you know,
more long lasting and more meaningful. Literally, it’s like, you know, it is insane rush of stuff that just happens in like such a short period of time. I would say, you know, when I had my first kind of viral moment, I was so eager to chase it up with something. Again, I think what I would do is focus on building, focus on converting people from that viral moment into
Snapchat emails.
Speaker 1 (21:20.824)
time.
Speaker 2 (21:30.306)
real fans. So at that point I didn’t have a website. I didn’t have any type of email list. I didn’t have any music out on Spotify. What I would have done differently is after that first video went viral, instead of trying to go back and hit a second viral video, which is, you know, don’t get me wrong. That’s important too. But I much, I think it’s much more important to say, okay, you’ve come in from this first video. Here’s my email list. Here’s how you stay connected with me. Here’s how you go check me out on Spotify. I would have
been much more focused on building out my presence on other platforms and creating kind of a holistic fan base rather than just like trying to chase it up with another viral moment because you know, it’s means to what end you just have a lot of followers and that’s, that’s cool. Don’t get me wrong, but like, you know, ultimately you want, you want to be, at least I want to be more than a content creator and then, you know, by no means am I like an expert on this. I’m still trying to do this to this day and like the website thing and
putting stuff out on Spotify and like releasing my own music. These are very recent developments. This took me like years to figure out where I was just trying to chase the next viral moment, chase the next viral video, the next clip. And, you know, I would see the following go up, but, you know, again, like to what end, know, ultimately my goal is to be a musician and someone who shares original music with people. And, you know, I was just kind of getting stuck in this loop of what’s the next viral video, what’s the next viral video. And,
Yeah, you know, I think it’s important these days to kind of like convert people over to the thing that you really care about. I don’t know if that answers your question.
a little bit. So how would you do that?
Speaker 2 (23:05.972)
So recently, just to use Sparks as an example, I struck gold to some degree with this Sparks moment with Coldplay where I had this sax solo that a bunch of people were using the audio of it. pretty quickly I was like, all right, need to get this out. Put out the full version that I made with a producer. I moved on it very, very quickly.
that’s the important part when you do hit you need to move you need to like move on to like keep pushing
And it can be very like paralyzing almost like I mean, I’d been doing this for years before I like finally it dawned on me. I was like, I should probably be putting these out and like, try to make this more of a official thing. But yeah, it is about moving quickly. And in that case, it’s like, okay, I’m having this thing on TikTok. It’s great. Super happy with it. But you know, I want to, I want to make these people fans. I want to make, I want to introduce them to my new music. So I put out sparks.
And then very shortly after that, I followed it up with my first single for my like new sort of like jazz house music project that I’m doing with my friend Will from Stolen Gin. So very quickly after that, just followed up with my debut like original single, which was, you know, really fun and successful. you know, it wasn’t as successful as the as the Sparks cover, but it was still like a great way to
take these people who had come in from Sparks and be like, hey, you know, this is my original music. This is something that I’m really passionate about and care about. And that’s how I kind of positioned it on social media. And now I’ve kind of gotten to the place where I’m like more comfortable with like promoting my own original music rather than just covers, you know? Like I’m trying to bridge that gap between, you know, getting people in the door with covers and now just getting them put onto my original stuff.
Speaker 1 (25:01.46)
You mentioned that it took some time for you to be able to promote your original music. Was that a imposter syndrome situation?
I honestly, I recently learned what this term is and I think it definitely, yeah, no doubt. We’re like, I don’t know if people- I’m a fraud. like this, this is just a fluke. And then it happened like five more times and I’m like, I still just got lucky. Like it’s not real. I definitely think there’s an element of that. And obviously, you know, part of that is just like a personal thing, but it’s something that a lot of people struggle with. Yeah. I think totally, you know, if-
If I could go back to that first viral moment, I would have just said, you know, fucking release anything, like put, put anything out. doesn’t need to be good. Like I, again, going back to what I was saying earlier, like there’s such an obsession, especially with music and today’s digital age where everything needs to be perfect. It’s like, there’s such a pressure to make sure that the stuff that the music that you’re putting out is like perfect and like good by your standards. And if I can just go back, you know,
I would just put something out, that you’re not going to get, if I could speak to my 20 year old self, I’d say, you’re not going to get better at this. you don’t like just put something out, something that resonated with me, I think, I forget who said it, but it was like strive for progress, not perfection. I think I would definitely like try to lead with that mentality more if I could go back and tell my old self to do so.
Let’s talk about the content creation and music mental checklist. So run me through how you approach the idea validation, the differences on the platforms, repeatability to hopefully be able to build a good framework.
Speaker 2 (26:48.462)
Do mean like, you know, kind of establishing your brand on socials?
Potentially, just so, you know, if, I’m struggling to find my niche, what are some tools and frameworks of thinking to make good series and good pieces of content?
I think people try to be too broad generally. I think, you know, the most effective thing that you can do is create consistency over a long period of time across various pieces of content. So for me, it’s the series that I’ve repeated for 50 plus installments, adding saxophone solos to songs that don’t need them. For other people, for other creators, it’s how are you creating a consistent
either visual or like, oral, like identity with your videos. So that can mean you’re entering the camera in the same way. Every video, you have the same type of text on screen at the beginning of every video, you’re in the same location, you’re using a similar, like color grading with all your videos. So I think it’s creating a consistent sort of image across multiple pieces of content. And when it comes to music, like that could be something that there’s this one band that I really love called La Lombe.
and they blew up online. They’re great musicians in their own right, but a big key to their success is they continue using like the same color grading in all of their videos so that the second that someone scrolls onto one of their videos, you’re like, all right, this is a La Lone video. And so I think anyone who’s trying to establish that brand, establish that presence online can take some notes from that and just be like, you know, what is my visual hook? What is my, you know, know, oral hook?
Speaker 2 (28:36.962)
you know, am I going to start every video the same way? Am I going to start every video with the same catchphrase or with the same sort of like visual cliche or something? For me, it was like at the beginning of the series, kind of had like, you know, I was in the same room. I had like this little point to this text on screen. So the second that everyone went to my video, it was like, all right, this is the same guy that’s been doing the saxolos. So I think that’s a big thing is like in this day and age where everyone’s like starved for attention and
attention spans are so short, you need to have some sort of cue at the beginning of all your pieces of content that signals to your viewers, this is the same person as it was the last time you watched one of these videos and you know what you’re gonna get immediately. I think when people get caught up is when they try to do too many different styles of content and people end up having no idea like what the brand is or what the focus of that individual page is because it’s a fashion page and it’s a music page and it’s a lifestyle page and it’s a story time page, you know.
You can do all those things, but you need to have one through line. So whether it’s you start the videos the same way, videos all look the same, some sort of cue for people to be like, all right, that is this particular creator and it needs to be like right at the beginning of the video.
Yeah, that’s a good point. Neaching down seems to be the constant factor with everyone I speak to.
was a very long winded way of saying, be consistent and make it obvious to people. Focus on one thing and when something works, do it again. I cannot stress that enough. People think that their followers are going to get tired or something and me, myself included, like when I’ve been in the process of like promoting a song, I’m like, Jesus, like I have to post this song again. Like my followers are going to fucking hate me. They’re going to be so annoyed at this.
Speaker 2 (30:20.748)
Truly, every time you post that video, it’s important. You need to get the messaging out to people as much as possible.
Yeah, I’ve noticed the niche is the most, is a very, important thing and sub niching, you know, a niche within a niche is also really, really useful. Personally, I’ve struggled to find that ability to find my niche due to the wide interest that I have and the only pieces of content that have gone viral was me explaining how to get out of a parking fine. I’m like, I don’t really know what to do with this.
I’m going down the life hack parking fine business and then a DJ and then a recent DJ set went viral. I don’t even want to be a DJ. What the fuck do do with this?
So, I mean, if I were to take my own advice here, and maybe this is, you know, this is just off the dome here, but like, how to get out of a parking fine, and then it’s like you transition into like playing a DJ set for the fucking traffic cop or whatever. It’s like, see, I also do this.
that’s so funny. Yeah. Yeah. I don’t know.
Speaker 2 (31:25.27)
You, you, you, I think you need to be a little bit shameless with it though. And that’s something that I struggle with just because I’m like very self-conscious of like, God, I just posted this like two days ago. People are going to get so tired of this. you know, a 30 second clip two days apart, someone who’s posting about it. You’re like, God, this is a lot. are people going to get fatigued to this? But the truth is when with the amount of content that people are consuming these days, it’s like, they don’t care.
think about it. Yeah, it makes a good point. I’m thinking of a few past podcast guests we’ve had like Jordan Toali has this thing. He’s a travel content creator. And his whole thing is like, what the heck every every video he starts off with.
I mean, that’s like, you know, that’s a perfect example. It’s like that, that, that, that vocal like cue almost it’s like his signature. And it’s like, it doesn’t even have anything to do with his content. You know, he’s a travel content creator. Like what the heck has nothing to do with check out my trip to Bali, but like that is the way that you kind of have to, it’s like your, it’s like your theme song almost. It’s like you hear it and you’re like, all right, I’m watching this show now.
And same with I’m thinking that Ari Elkins, he has a blue chair.
Yes, exactly. Same blue chair every time, same framing. He like sits down in the thing and he’s like, yeah.
Speaker 1 (32:38.572)
Yeah, so you’re onto something there. It’s worth really thinking. I got to just find an apartment where I just don’t want to leave so I can settle in.
And that’s, again, it’s like as someone who’s like trying to do this consistently, it’s like, God, I’m getting bored. These people must be getting bored too. Usually that’s not the case, but.
What happens when you have failed at a piece of content or a gig or something hasn’t worked out? How do you dissect it and then improve? What are you thinking?
Everyone has related to that experience of like spending hours or even days on a video and then it gets like a couple of shadow. Also, by the way, a lot of people claim shadow band and I’m like, I don’t think you’re shadow band. just don’t think that’s mean. Yeah. Low key. Yeah. I mean, you have to be willing to make a fool of yourself. This is a total hard left, but
by TikTok.
Speaker 2 (33:40.94)
Taylor Swift was our commencement speaker for graduation. And the one thing that she said, she actually had a great speech. But one of the things that she said that I thought was like really impactful is like, she’s like, I know everybody thinks I’m cringy. Not everybody, she has a huge fan base. She’s the biggest pop star ever. obviously everyone doesn’t think she’s cringy, but over the year, over however many years she’s been putting out music, 15 years, 20 years, there’s been, you
Be now.
Speaker 2 (34:10.19)
immense criticism for her work. Plenty of people calling her, you know, a hack or a failure. Oh, you’re just writing songs about your ex boyfriend. The biggest accusation that she’s gotten is, oh, I’m being cringe. And I think a lot of people feel like they’re being cringe when they put out some content that doesn’t do well. And I think the thing that’s, what she said is the thing that’s been able to help her is like, people think that it’s like cool not to try it anything.
But like, that’s really not the case. your fear of being cringe is like stopping you from pursuing something that you love. And keep in mind, she phrased that much more eloquently than I did. But that’s all to say, like, if content creation is something that you’re interested in pursuing, you kind of have to be willing to put out a video that flops and just follow it up with something better. Like, I’ve gone through literal.
period like month long periods where nothing I’m doing is really hidden. You know, that’s part of the journey. You know, not everything is going to is going to be a hit. And I think if content creation and putting sharing your stuff online is something that is important to you and is something that you’re interested in, like you kind of have to accept that that is the reality of the situation. Not everything is going to go viral. These things come in waves like I explained earlier, like the first time I went viral, I got hit with so many emails, brand opportunities, this, that the other.
this is great. This is just going to be like my life now. And then of course, three, four weeks later, it’s like, all where’s all the emails? I thought we were about to be set for life. So periods of great viral success come in waves and periods of viral nothingness and barrenness also comes in waves. if this is the life that you choose, I think you have to just be prepared for
willing to take those failures on the chin.
Speaker 1 (36:02.69)
Have you changed your content and the way you’ve worked when you go through those periods of nothing happening or are you just sticking to the course?
I have in a period of like nothing really working. I’ve definitely been like, all right, it’s time to switch. And then I switch and then it’s like, I still don’t really find it. And then when I go back to my original plan, always, it always gets better. So I honestly feel like if P if you’re lucky enough for people to know you for doing one thing.
More often than not, that thing is going to be like your thing. That should be like your guiding light. That’s the North Star of like, this has worked before. This is what people have resonated with when I’ve posted it. That’s going to be what I always return to. yeah, a little bit. I think I definitely don’t want to sound like I’m advocating for not changing your content. I think the way that you have to do it.
I’ll you in a box though.
Speaker 2 (36:58.638)
is be subtle about it and continue with that through line but just diverted it a little bit to one way or the other. So for me, you know, I’m posting videos of adding sax solos to songs that don’t need them. I’m in the same room every time. I’m doing kind of the same point. It’s a similar framing. But now let’s say I want to, you know, promote my new song that I’m just, you know, that I’m preparing to release in a couple of weeks. Now I’m going to use the same format, same lighting, same room, same text or whatever.
but the music is gonna be different. And now it’s like the video is being presented in the same way and in the same format, but the actual content and the goal of the content has changed. So I think whenever you as a content creator are trying to shift your strategy, you have to maintain a little bit of that through line and that brand consistency while also being subtly you’re moving content in a different direction. So you can say to your followers and your fans, hey, come along.
I’m still staying loyal and true to what my brand is and the reason that you follow me in the first place, but I’m going to take you on this journey. That’s a little bit off, off course. So, you know, I definitely am a big proponent of, know, as you change, change your content, change the way that you share with people. But with that in mind, it’s important to like, be cognizant of the reason that people follow you in the first place. Don’t take a hard left. If you’re going to change course, and if you’re going to like change the style of your content,
Do it in a way that is mindful for the reason that people follow you in the first place. you know, and if you’re throwing something completely expected to people, maybe this works for other people, but it hasn’t worked for me. You know, I always think it’s a better recipe for success. If you’re going to change course, you need some of the elements of your old content to kind of be incorporated into whatever it is that you’re doing. That’s new.
Yeah, makes sense. Nice. So conscious of time and wrapping up a little bit, I’d like to just get some general philosophical thoughts about you and how you view the world. So what’s the biggest thing over the last two years you’ve changed your mind on?
Speaker 2 (39:04.366)
I think that preserving people’s, preserving people’s like view of you and how you think that you’re viewed is, I think I used to think that that was more important than honesty and being honest. I think more recently I’ve suffered for trying to be the version of myself that people would like the most or that would just offend the least amount of people.
Not that I’m a particularly offensive guy, I definitely am a people pleaser by nature. I think I’ve learned that potentially putting people off or rubbing people the wrong way can almost be worth it if you’re being honest and speaking your mind. I think if you speak your mind to someone and they don’t value you the same way, then
Probably not someone that you wanted in your circle in the first place.
Yeah, I think truth is the most important goal to get to across everything that you’re doing, just getting to the core truth of what’s going on.
I think my primary goal for a lot of my life had been like, just want to appeal to as many people as possible.
Speaker 1 (40:21.486)
Is that an insecurity thing?
I think so, and I think honestly that, you know, I don’t think that, you know, being a content creator and being someone who’s constantly putting themselves out there on the internet for people to judge, I mean, it certainly hasn’t made that easier.
I mean, you’ve managed to find some validations.
Yeah, you know, but you know, it’s like that validation is very it’s like it’s like like junk food like it feels good in the moment, but you’re like, man, this is sick. Yeah. And then when it’s like, all right now, and then your next it’s like when your video is getting 1 million views and then your next video is getting like a thousand. It’s like, yeah, dude, it’s like, you know, again, it comes in waves and I feel like you just kind of, yeah, just have to fucking keep, keep paddling, keep swimming through those waves.
thing.
Speaker 1 (40:52.406)
mine just get a thousand.
Speaker 2 (41:05.614)
Yeah, but just being just being honest is more important than trying to be the version of yourself that you think people are going to want. Yeah.
I mean, look, there’s a, think as I’m getting older, the tactfulness of honesty is important. Like being tactful and tasteful about how you convey that honesty is useful, but getting to that truth is really, really, really important. Yeah, for sure. So what’s, what’s an act that somebody has done for you, a kind act that somebody has done that maybe wasn’t a big deal for them, but had a huge impact on your life?
I would say I have a couple of friends who, like, they don’t even realize it, but just, yeah, I think in New York, everyone is like super busy all the time and people are like, there’s almost this like collective insecurity about like wanting to be vulnerable and like opening up to people and like asking people to like spend time with them. I love when a random friend who I haven’t spoken to in a while just like hits me up to hang out, go get a drink or a bite or something.
That honestly means so much to me whenever I have a friend that does that. Especially if it’s someone who I haven’t seen in a while, I might be like, oh, I don’t know if I really want to hit them up. They might not be interested or around or something. But I’ve just gained such an appreciation for people who are like, oh, let’s link up. You never know how much that’s going to mean to someone. that always touches my heart when I have a friend who I haven’t spoken to in a while that reaches out.
How has that act of kindness impacted the way you navigate the world?
Speaker 2 (42:44.908)
I think it’s just allowed me to be more open and honest with people, especially the people who I love and care about. know, there’s never going to be, you know, I’m always worried or I have been worried in the past that, you know, my act, you know, me reaching out is not going to be received in the way that I want it to be. you know, I just think, you know, if it impacts me in such a positive way, then why wouldn’t it impact, then why wouldn’t me reaching out and, and being that open, honest version of myself also like.
mean the same amount to them too.
Yeah, definitely. What’s the most beautiful thing you’ve created?
I think, I think, you know, I, do, I do think sparks is, is beautiful in its own right. But I, I think Coldplay created more than I did. I added a little part to it, which people seem to like, but I can’t say, that that’s been my, honestly, I think, the, there’s a, it’s all about, I think relationships for me. I think the relationship.
that I’ve built with my band has been something that has taught me so, much. So many lessons about honesty and hard work and working together through times of tension and struggle. And like we have had, you know, small personal differences and, you know, just various struggles of, you know, being in a...
Speaker 2 (44:16.622)
tiny tight van together for weeks at a time and then we go out and we create this beautiful music together. I think the most beautiful thing that I’ve been lucky enough to create is like the relationships in my life, whether it’s with my band or with my family or my girlfriend, you know, that’s just something that I’m constantly working on.
Thanks. So if you could gift only one book to people for the rest of your life, what would that book be?
The Four Agreements is really good. I’ve only read it once, but I’ve been meaning to go back to it because it’s so good.
I remember reading that after Tash Sultana put it on a story years ago.
Tash Sultana. Yeah, she’s cool.
Speaker 1 (45:04.172)
Yeah, she’s cool. Be impeccable with your words. Don’t take anything personally. Don’t make assumptions. Always do your best.
Yeah, it’s been a couple of years since I read it, it really impacted me when I did. yeah, it’s just a beautiful way of looking at life.
Yeah. I feel like a lot of those books as well, you read them once you have one pass at it, it does something to you and then you forget. And then a few years later, you’re like, probably should read this and then something else comes up and then you reread. I think it’s, I’m getting to a point where I’ve like probably read, I’m not a massively fast reader, but I’d like to have some form of audio book or book in my life. And there’s a few books that I read at the start of my reading journey when I was 18, 19, that I think are well overdue to be read again.
Yeah, reading is tough. It’s something that I used to do and I feel like, you know, I do feel like going through school kind of put a dent on my relationship with reading and now I’m really trying to get back to it. You know, there’s so much pleasure and joy in it that I feel like I lost and that I’m trying to kind of like reconnect with my childhood relationship with it.
because you’re reading for specific circumstances.
Speaker 1 (46:14.126)
Yeah, how are you doing that? Just getting into it.
Just like actively seeking out books by people that I admire, like Anthony Bourdain is the one that I mentioned earlier. I sort of created this association in my mind through high school and college, that reading was something that was not fun. And coming to the realization that there were books by people who I really value their insight on the world is like a totally...
just changed my perspective on it. I was like, oh, like I really need to kind of, it’s just a different way of like interfacing with people whose opinions that you respect.
Yeah, there’s a quote that I think about in that space that said, read for enjoyment until you enjoy reading. So basically just find things you really enjoy reading, whatever it may be, it doesn’t matter what it is, but until you get to the point where you just begin to really enjoy the specific act of reading and then you’ll begin to be able to read harder, more challenging pieces of writing.
Speaker 1 (47:28.494)
Just keep reading what you enjoy until that point. And I also find it fascinating that a vast majority of really successful people in whatever domains they do are all big readers. And you can take someone’s whole life experience, someone who might charge a million dollars an hour to talk to if you wanted to get them into a room has spent
years thinking about and then dissecting ideas and putting them down on paper and you can buy that thing for 20 bucks.
That’s easy. You know, I do think it goes back to like, if you’re trying to put something out into the world, whether it’s a piece of art or a piece of writing or a piece of, I don’t know, any type of product out into the world, I think you need to have a certain degree of like life experience. And I think that that can like honestly be gotten through
learning about other people’s life experiences. And that is also a version of their truth that can be incorporated into whatever you’re doing. I think the more life experience that you have and the more life experience that you can almost absorb through reading other people’s life experiences, hopefully the more truth will be reflected in whatever it is that you’re producing.
Yeah, definitely. So wrapping up, is there anything you’re excited about at the moment that you want to let the listeners in on?
Speaker 2 (48:59.158)
Yeah, there’s a few things. I don’t think this is probably not going to come out before Govball, but we have Govball on June 6, which I’m super excited for. That’s with my band, Stolen Gin. And then looking a little bit ahead, we have a festival in July, July 4th in Missoula, Montana, where KC Musgraves and Hozier are going to be headlining, which is going to be sick. And then I am, you know,
I’ve recently launched my like stolen gin side project, which is called Evan plus Will that I’m doing with my friend Will. It’s like a jazz house, like burleaus type thing with a little bit more of like a modern daft punky production twist. So we’re putting out our new song beginning of June. So I’m really excited for that. And yeah, just lots of new music, lots of shows. That’s what I love to do. And that’s what I think I’m best at.
And what’s one lesson that you hope that everyone can take away from the conversation?
that it is not people, people respond much more to something that is emotionally charged than something that is impressive, like technically impressive. So, you know, I always think about music in this way. I am much more drawn to someone playing something very, very simple, but in a very emotional way.
than I am to something very complex that is played like really quickly and really, know, virtuosically, but without emotion. And I think people learn music and they learn whatever their trade is in the opposite way of that. So they’re much more focused on getting the virtuosic thing down than they are about getting the emotional thing down. And I think for the vast majority of people, whether you’re a music fan or not, whether you’re a big writing, you know, writer or not, people respond much more to something that is emotionally charged and raw.
Speaker 2 (50:56.182)
and something that is super technical and refined. And I think that’s a good approach to art and I think that’s a good approach to life too.
Yeah. I think about the conversation that Rick Rubin had around Johnny Cash producing Hurt. Do you know about this? Yeah. And it’s just fascinating. They were just struggling to find the soul in the album. And then they got to this point where it was just him and a guitar. it was like Hurt is like one of the craziest songs ever. It’s beautiful. It’s insane.
I’ve heard this story.
Speaker 2 (51:32.334)
It’s so, it’s, mean, that I Rick Rubin is a good example of that. You know, I’ve seen plenty of interviews with him. I’ve seen lots of interview clips of him talking and you his approach is so rooted in like, let’s kind of throw out, let’s just trust our intuition here. Let’s trust the fact that we’ve done our training. We’ve done our homework. We’ve done our due diligence and let’s just kind of make this art on pure raw emotion. And I love that.
Definitely, So where can people find you if they’re interested?
Um, can just Google my name, Evan Jacobson on TikTok, Instagram, YouTube, Spotify, all that.
Yeah, cool man. And last one for you is what do you think the meaning of life is?
Love each other, be honest. I think that there is no deep, deep meaning to life. And I think that’s what gives life its meaning. It’s just, it is what it is. So just connect with people where you can, be honest, and lead with that, and you’ll have a happy life, hopefully.
Speaker 1 (52:44.27)
Thanks, Evan.
Thanks so much, Adam. Appreciate it.
Cool. All right. If you’ve made it this far, please jump onto YouTube. Search that one time with Adam Metwally. Click Subscribe, like the video, and leave us a comment.
